A Dance Lesson

The following is a transcript of a moment during a weekend workshop for teachers, which took place on December 14, 1991 in Besançon, France.

N. B.
– Christiane Rozet (CR) attended dance lessons with François Malkovsky for about 20 years
– Glenys Hanson (GH) has no experience with this or any kind of dance.
– X, CA, RY and SB are other participants.


Can we teach a skill we don’t possess ourselves?

After a long silence and in connection with the subject of study (which was “Can we be a teacher in an area if we are not ourselves experts in the field”), Glenys said ” For example, could I give Christiane a dance lesson? ”


GH: Because when I was thinking about what I would do, what came to me was not “What do I know about dancing?” but “If I look at  Christiane dancing, how can I know where her problems are? What should I do to help her progress? ” I think she can show me the way.
X: Mutual trust is very important.
GH: Yes, and I felt ……

– After a break –

The problems

GH: So you said you know where your problems are.
CR: Yes, I know a number of problems, yes.
GH: So what are they? (Silence)
CR: I have to choose one. Something a bit general …. (long pause) Well, let’s work on the use of body weight and the shifting of the centre of gravity.

The right time

GH: And where is the problem?
CR: The problem is that in some exercises especially, but everywhere … I can’t or I do not know how, I don’t manage to… I know I have to do two things … to correctly displace my centre of gravity: either I don’t do it at the right time, or I don’t do it enough.
GH: And how do you know it’s not the right time?
CR: Because I get to the end of my gesture after the music.
GH: And you feel the gesture is not with the music.
CR: Because I have to make an effort I shouldn’t need to… (inaudible)
GH: And are there times when you do it well?
CR: Yes, I feel that it’s almost that.
GH: And when you see someone else do it, do you recognize it?
CR: Not always.
GH: But when it’s you yourself who do it, do you recognize it?
CR: Mmmm.
GH: How do you … (inaudible)
CR: If it’s in a turning movement, because I get dizzy.
GH: If it is not done properly?
CR: If it is not done properly.
GH: So your sense of balance tells you.
CR: Yes, because, as I said, I’m behind the music.
GH: I don’t understand.
CR: I have to make an effort to catch up.
GH: Ah! In another movement!
CR: I have to cheat, you see.
GH: Is it something that often occurs when you dance, or is it all the time,
or is it ….?
CR: Oh, it’s quite often.

Ways of walking

GH: And the other times? Your centre of gravity is it where it should be?
CR: In dance, you mean?
GH: Yes.
CR: Yes, that can happen, yes.


GH: And when you walk normally, without dancing, where is your centre of gravity?
CR: Hmmmmm. I use it a badly.
GH: And how do you know that?
CR: I know that because I know I’m not in the ideal position, if you like, for the type of dance I do.
GH: What makes you say that?
CR: Well … I know because I’ve been told, I know because when I see myself walking, if I look at myself in the mirror, it’s awful. If I see myself filmed I know it’s not right, Three quarters of the time I walk without thinking about what’s going on, so I’m not aware of it. If I have an image myself walking.
GH: But what is it….. I’ve seen you walk and there was nothing specially shocking to me.
CR: But when Malko saw me walk, he would tear out his hair!.
GH: Let me see.
CR: Yes, but if I walk in front of you, knowing you’re all looking at me, I’ll change what I do.
GH: No, but what is there to see in your way of walking that you see and I don’t?
CR: My legs do too much work. (Silence) There’s not enough fluidity in my spine.
CA: But if you pay attention, is it the same?
CR: I can fix some things, yes. I know that if I walk into a dance class, I don’t walk as I walk in the street.
GH: (silence) How many ways of walking do you have?
CR: (silence) How many…, I don’t know … I have a way of walking empty handed, a way of walking if I carry things, a way of walking on days when things are going well, I have no discomfort, There’s a way of walking in a dance class, a way of walking because I have to move fast to tell a colleague about something … I don’t know, there are an infinite number of ways.

Movements of the centre of gravity

GH: Is your centre of gravity the same in all these cases? Can you describe how it changes?
CR: If I carry heavy things, shopping bags, there’s a blockage in my shoulders, in the movement of the spine. I move a lot less well. In that situation, I really walk with my legs, only with my legs. If I walk and I’m in a hurry, well, I use … (inaudible word) my centre of gravity, Otherwise I wouldn’t get there. If I’m in a dance class, I’ll be careful ……….. If I walk down the street thinking about something else … spontaneously, it’s not great.
GH: When you say “not great”, that means …
CR: That I won’t use my centre of gravity enough. I’ll let myself get blocked.
GH: Do you know people who walk less well than you?
CR: Yes.
GH: And what do they do?
CR: They’re even stiffer than me.
GH: Can show us how someone who walks less well than you does it?
CR: Than me? (Laughs) Like soldiers marching. (She demonstrates.)
RY: You do it very well, all the same.
(Inaudible: laughter and comments of the other participants).
SB: Do you see anything else in the process, other than your legs and your spine?
CR: Yes. The whole body is involved …….
SB: And in particular?
CR: In particular,  the situating of my centre of gravity, and then the fluidity of movement, ….. the functioning of all the joints.
SB: What are you present to …… where is your attention when you try to walk well?
CR: There at the level of the solar plexus (she points).
GH: And when you walk well, where your is attention
CR: When I walk well? I don’t know if I can walk well, let’s say when I walk less badly. I want to say it is centred there (she points to her solar plexus), but it’s …… everywhere.
GH: When you try, it’s more centred there, but when you succeed it is more diffuse.
CR:. …… (Inaudible) it’s  spread out. It resonates everywhere.

Visualising yourself

GH: (silence) Can you see that when you make a move correctly?
CR: Mmmm! Yes, more or less, not for all the movements, but for some.
GH: If you take a given movement, when you are visualizing yourself, are you visualizing yourself from the inside or the outside?
CR: (silence) I can do both ……. I’m pretty much on the outside.
GH: I used the word “see”, but can you evoke yourself in non-visual ways – such as sensations, the warmth of your body… Is it is the same everywhere in your body at that moment?
CR: Wait a minute. I’ll choose a particular movement and see what happens. (She does a movement.) Mmmm! It’s not the same. I get the impression that if the movement is successful there is more heat in the extremities, in the hands.
GH: Can you evoke the muscle tension in different parts of your body? In that same movement?

Cut in two

CR: (silence) It’s easy in the lower part of my body, from the pelvis to the legs ….. (inaudible).
GH: What do you do with your tongue? At that moment is it tense or relaxed?
CR: If the movement is successful, it’s relaxed.
GH: And what parts are tense?
CR: (silence) I’m really aware, in evocation, of the lower part of my body. It’s odd, because I have a problem in the lower back, as if I was cut in half, you see! The problem is there, I really feel cut cut in two there..
GH: You feel what? Is it tension, is it, …
CR: I’m aware of my legs, I’m aware of my leg muscles, I’m aware of the position of my pelvis, I’m not so aware of my trunk, a little of the arms, but I’m much less aware of the upper part of my torso.
GH: And if you visualize yourself from the outside, is it the same? Can you visualize better …..
CR: Mmm! It’s complex …… a while ago it was a bit more complex and much more … global. From the outside I can be everywhere at once.
GH: Would you like to do this movement now?
CR: Of course. This is the one. (She does a dance movement.)
GH: Is what you did exactly as your …….? (end of the recording)


Editor’s note:

Seven months later, we asked Christiane what was left of this lesson:

CR: I was very surprised to have made discoveries with Glenys which I never managed with Malko. In particular, I had lots of insights about my centre of gravity. Now I know the way to go if I want, for example, to succeed in the movement worked on during the lesson with Glenys.

Transcription of the French recording: Lois Rose
Translation into English: Glenys Hanson

© Glenys Hanson, Lois Rose, Christiane Rozet. The Science of Education in Questions, N° 7, June, 1992, Besançon, France.

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“A dance lesson”  is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-NoDerivs 3.0 Unported License.

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